Author Topic: David Brown Knocking  (Read 20498 times)

wee-allis

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Re: David Brown Knocking
« Reply #15 on: 02 September, 2014, 08:02:27 am »

Hi John,
All the old side valve Chrysler/Dodge/ Plymouth/ Desoto engines had a water distribution tube fitted to the block. It was intended to cool the valve seats to prevent valves from over heating and burning out, particularly at the rear of the block.  I have replaced heaps of them in  the past, BUT, have also found heaps of them missing, without any apparent problems, including on concrete agitators.

In saying that, Cranky's fix would be a good idea to make sure.
Cheers, Steve.
If it's old, treat it like gold.
 38 Allis B,50 Morris Six,  Moruya, Sth coast NSW.

cobbadog

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Re: David Brown Knocking
« Reply #16 on: 02 September, 2014, 04:40:09 pm »
Thank you guys for the input. I think that a tube of some sort is in order. Talking to another owner last night about this topic of water distribution tube and the possibility of it causing pre-ignition and valve problems the penny may have dropped for me when we used his one on a trek and part of the way along the trek we had ignition problems, miss firing and running very rough and also as if it was not running on all cylinders. This just may have been what was wrong as the tractor has not gone on another trek since then but if you start it up and run it around the farm now it goes great.
So in theory the copper tube is slightly crushed and then thin slits are cut into the tube in line with each of the valve stems. Is this correct? Is a 1mm cut off disc too thin or should it be a hacksaw blade thickness? Does the tube run the full length of the head and held in place by the flat end cap at the rear of the head and the water pump body at the front?
I am happy to receive as much information on this one as you wish to supply. Thank you so much.
Cheers, John & Dee. Coopernook. NSW.

cranky crank

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Re: David Brown Knocking
« Reply #17 on: 02 September, 2014, 09:25:18 pm »
Hi,
The tube ran the full length of the head and is located at either end. One end is behind the cap. I just squashed the copper pipe in a vice to suit the teardrop shape and kept playing around till it fitted snugly and when happy just peened the edges to seal against the cast iron at both ends. I think the david brown book had a picture of the tube with the slots. I used a thin angle grinder blade and cut in about 1/4 inch. I did have a part of the old tube which helped with the spacings of the cuts but that was a long time ago.

cobbadog

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Re: David Brown Knocking
« Reply #18 on: 03 September, 2014, 05:10:02 pm »
This is a huge help to us in our restoration and I can see how it would work now that you have described it so well in the peening it over and it's overall length. I will measure up the opening when I get the head back so I can then buy some tubing the correct diameter. Thank you so much for this great tip and how to do it as well.
Cheers, John & Dee. Coopernook. NSW.

cobbadog

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Re: David Brown Knocking
« Reply #19 on: 19 September, 2014, 04:25:47 pm »
At last I am getting a life back and managing to find time away from work. A belated but big thanks again to Wee Allis for sending the big end bolts and locking tabs, they are superb.
Most of the new parts are paid for and on there way from the UK and I will be buying the rest locally when I need to. I did however find a guy from Newcastle area who makes stainless water distribution tubes exactly as the originals were made which is a bonus for those of us who either want a stainless one or don't have the means to make the copper one. So in about 2 weeks the tricky bits will be here and then the crank can be ground to size and reassembly can start. This being my first tractor engine rebuild it has been interesting the slight differences between them and a car engine but it is good and I just want to keep things rolling and get the job done and finished. Mind you the last car engine I did was about 30 years ago. So the grey matter is in overload at the moment. At least a heap of good photos and friends with advise will get me out of trouble if it happens.
Cheers, John & Dee. Coopernook. NSW.

cobbadog

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Re: David Brown Knocking
« Reply #20 on: 01 October, 2014, 10:16:08 am »
Parts arrived 2 days ago and they are now at the engineering shop so the crank can now be ground to size to suit the ones I bought. So not too far into the future, hopefully, I can collect my bits and put Humpty Dumpty together again.
Cheers, John & Dee. Coopernook. NSW.

ianoz

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Re: David Brown Knocking
« Reply #21 on: 01 October, 2014, 07:23:35 pm »
Good to hear John .Keep us posted .
fowler vf,david brown 30td,cat D24U,D47U,D47J,D46U,R4,D68U IH TD9,TD6 and many more
 Benaraby Central Queensland

cobbadog

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Re: David Brown Knocking
« Reply #22 on: 07 October, 2014, 11:14:17 am »
I am hopeful that the engine will be ready to pick up later this week at long last.  ::)
Cheers, John & Dee. Coopernook. NSW.

cobbadog

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Re: David Brown Knocking
« Reply #23 on: 18 October, 2014, 05:19:45 pm »
Finally got the engine home and ready to start putting Humpty Dumpty together again. BUT, then things go slightly pear shaped. When I received the parcel of parts from the UK I questioned the thickness of the front and rear main oil seal cork strips. Was told that they were correct and to prove this just fit the engine in place and measure the gap and all should be good. Well early this week the UK supplier sent an email stating that the seals were too thin and that new ones are on there way to me as I read this email, they have not arrived yet!
Cheers, John & Dee. Coopernook. NSW.

cobbadog

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Re: David Brown Knocking
« Reply #24 on: 29 October, 2014, 03:54:21 pm »
All parts are here and awaiting assembly including a new clutch kit. This Saturday afternoon seems to be the starting time for this monumental and long awaited episode to start to come to an end. The correct thickness front and rear main oil seals are finally here too.
Cheers, John & Dee. Coopernook. NSW.

cobbadog

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Re: David Brown Knocking
« Reply #25 on: 31 October, 2014, 02:36:04 pm »
I know that there is an equal division on the subject of fitting a new water tube into the head of these Cropmasters. Some say definitely don't need it and some say definitely do. As an insurance policy I did buy one out of the Newcastle area from a member of the Crank Handle Club. It arrived yesterday and it looks great. I will be fitting it soon as I need to fit the head in place. If a picture is needed I will take one before I install it.
Cheers, John & Dee. Coopernook. NSW.

cobbadog

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Re: David Brown Knocking
« Reply #26 on: 02 November, 2014, 03:39:01 pm »
At long last the procedure for re-assembly of the engine and clutch back into Mr Brown has started. I put #1 & #4 pistons back into the bores as one of them is a bit tricky to get at when the block is in place  and I left the two middle ones out so I could thread my rope through for lifting the block back in place. I spent a lot of time getting the front and rear main oil seals in place so that they would not move when the block was lowered into place. These seals are just a length of cork and are only made to seal half of the front and rear mains. Then I had to fit the gaskets that seal between the block and the tractor frame using Permatex gasket jointing liquid which is nice and thick and holds them in place nicely. Then I have fitted the back engine plate and flywheel and then the front timing plate and camshaft and timed it as well. I blew the whistle  as I thought that I have achieved (for me) enough for the day and I am happy with the results.
Cheers, John & Dee. Coopernook. NSW.

cobbadog

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Re: David Brown Knocking
« Reply #27 on: 04 November, 2014, 04:32:45 pm »
Up until I am ready to fit the head I am leaving the lump of angle in place to ensure a liner doesn't pop up. Just my own little insurance policy for my little brain.
Cheers, John & Dee. Coopernook. NSW.

Mightgo

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Re: David Brown Knocking
« Reply #28 on: 05 November, 2014, 04:20:20 pm »
Hi John. Looks good,   Wonder how we all would get by without the good old blue & yellow rope?      Regards Brian.

cobbadog

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Re: David Brown Knocking
« Reply #29 on: 05 November, 2014, 05:09:32 pm »
Yeah. I got my eye on a shank of it being used by the NBN guys. It has a million uses but not to tie down engines or vintage mowers anymore as we transport them to Rallies.
Cheers, John & Dee. Coopernook. NSW.